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ISRAELI PALESTINIAN PEACE SIMULATION - Shared screen with speaker view
Ian Lustick
42:00
A 30% discount is available when purchasing my book, Paradigm Lost by going here https://www.pennpress.org/9780812251951/paradigm-lost/ and enter inghe coupon code: LUSTICK30
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
01:11:04
Can you please say something about military capacity? Are you assuming the current status of only one army (and a kinda PA security system...) or are you assuming there is demilitarisation?
Jesse Bevan
01:23:59
it's progress if 1 peace proposal out of 20 doesn't get vetoed on the first legislative session
Jesse Bevan
01:29:26
no veto from PA
Ian Lustick
01:30:33
there are more right-leaning members of Lapid coalitions than there are Arab or left leadning members
Ian Lustick
01:31:06
I would like to know the Hamas leader's rationale for accepting this legislation.
Jesse Bevan
01:31:20
so it was vetoed? lets move on to different legislation
Jesse Bevan
01:33:34
because the PM vetoed
Jesse Bevan
01:33:49
hamas leader did NOT veto= move on
Jesse Bevan
01:34:21
maybe hamas leader expected Israeli pm to veto. we will never know hypothetically
Elly Levy
01:34:42
HHHHH
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
01:41:36
Can we call in Blue Helmets instead? Or in parallel.
Jesse Bevan
01:43:14
no veto for PA
Jesse Bevan
01:43:42
but PA demands checkpoints be removed ASAP
Ron Grodko
01:51:50
This tax proposal effectively means that Israel will fund the IPC, because the Israeli economy is much bigger
Ron Grodko
01:52:22
the Israeli 3% is much bigger than than the Palestinians
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
01:54:05
So the Israelis are seen as the spoilers. I don't think Israelis will vote easily for this but I voted for it on that basis... (I considered whether intnl funding should be the economic base, but that would weaken the connection and open it to accusations that it was "the EU" interfering... i.e. illegitimate)
Carl Goldberg
01:54:32
Are yo seriously claiming that Israel has refused to make peace for 74 years? What about the several wars of annihilation launched by surrounding Arab/Moslem states? What about the consistently proclaimed goals of Hamas and Fatah to create an Arab/Islamic state from the River to the Sea?
Jesse Bevan
01:55:17
PA vetoes
Dan Tennant-Ralphs
02:01:05
sorry I'm late, salaam shalom from Madrid 🙏
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:01:26
What about refugees in diaspora - Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and elsewhere.
Jesse Bevan
02:04:08
"refugee camps" should be dismantled and the people in Syria, Lebanon and Jordan should be citizens of those countries
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:04:30
Agreed Jesse.
Jacqueline Swartz
02:04:43
we can't wait generation's in this case - Palestinian land is occupied day by day.
Carl Goldberg
02:05:09
How can Israel evolve to include its enemies who are committed to destroying Israel?
Jacqueline Swartz
02:05:38
this is not the US or Ireland
Jesse Bevan
02:05:52
status quo in Israel/Palestine is not sustainable and aparteid and war will only get worse
Jesse Bevan
02:07:11
how do we end the blockade of gaza. this must be addressed by Israel AND Egypt
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:07:19
Question: The late Prof. Zeev Sternhell said fascism doesn't self-right, it requires outside mediation. As we descend now into being a state where fascism is increasingly normalised (Ben-Gvir et al.) do you see this system being something that the intnl. community will participate in setting up? Because it seems the genie is out of the bottle, with all that implies.
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:08:04
Where does climate and non-proliferation kick in?
Jesse Bevan
02:10:20
how does the "refugee" camps in other countries like Syria, Lebanon and Jordan play since they are all stateless?
Lawrence Wilkerson
02:22:25
I find it hard to believe that four billion US dollars annually given almost gratis to Israel by the US has no influence. US leaders are too frightened to use that influence (since HW Bush, anyway); so that is the issue, not that there is no potential for influence -- huge potential in fact. It would just take a courageous US leader, or a massive shift in domestic politics in the US -- a shift that is coming slowly but surely. Look at AIPAC, for example. It has lost a battle or two of late. That's unprecedented.
Carl Goldberg
02:22:50
So, they agree to change the name from "Anti-Zionism" for public relations purposes even though they are anti-Zionist and want to destroy Israel as a Jewish state!
Marcia G. Yerman
02:29:45
@IanLustick: Can you put a link in the chat about the upcoming talk on Zionism you will be taking part in?
Ian Lustick
02:30:36
I can't do that but can send it to individuals who request it directly from me at ilustick@sas.upenn.edu
Marcia G. Yerman
02:32:08
OK. Great.
Carl Goldberg
02:43:40
Sure, one state between the River and the sea! That is exactly what Hamas and Fatah have always advocated!
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:46:08
I think the reference was to the military regulation regime for the West Bank by which Israeli settlers' status is regulated. It should be renewed but wasn't able to be by the current coalition, which is why we are going to another election. As a means of avoiding the issue's then deadline. The opposition (Bibi) obviously voted for elections... people like Amichai Chikli and Idit Silman were voting by then outside coalition..
Carl Goldberg
02:47:48
Thank you, Len!!!
Elly Levy
02:48:20
THANK YOU, PROFESSOR!
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:48:58
By 2050 Israel will be the 2nd most dense state in the world, after only Bangladesh. Plus we (I speak as an Israeli) are already No. 2 most water stressed nation on earth, after Qatar. So this isn't sustainable. Climate will teach us lessons we are unwilling to learn...BDS isn't genocidal. It says the refugee issue must be negotiated. That's not calling for destruction of Israel.
Ian Lustick
02:49:38
And Gaza is ten times more densely populated than the rest of Israel.
Angela Godfrey-Goldstein
02:50:28
Exactly, professor. Plus how many refugees would want to return? Shlomo Ben Ami had a plan (not agreed by the refugees themselves - big flaw)...
Elly Levy
02:50:33
THANK YOU , ANGELA,
Carl Goldberg
02:50:43
Angela, what you are advocating is a democracy whereby two lions and a lamb will vote on what to have for dinner.