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PCA Town Hall Meeting (June 21 @8:00pm EST) - Shared screen with speaker view
Colleen Karn (she/her)
30:20
Town Hall Meeting Procedures & Protocol1. Civility: Treat others as you wish to be treated. Remember, the PCA’s Code of Conduct applies to this meeting. Please review it. Anyone violating the Code of Conduct, whether when speaking or in the chat, will be politely warned once. If a member violates the Code of Conduct a second time, they will be removed from the meeting.2. Orderly Discussion: We ask all participants to keep their microphones muted when not speaking. Please raise your virtual hand if you wish to speak. Then wait until the moderator calls on you. If you prefer to have the moderator read your comments, please put them in the chat.3. All Voices Matter: This meeting is for everyone to have their voices heard. Therefore, members will be limited to 3 minutes of “floor time.” If, after everyone gets a chance to speak, there is still time left, you may raise your hand to speak again.
Colleen Karn (she/her)
31:20
4. Productive Not Destructive: The purpose of this meeting is for members to voice their concerns regarding San Antonio as the location of our 2023 conference, as well as discuss possible bright sides to San Antonio; be sure to stay on topic. (If you stray off topic, you will be reminded to stay on topic, and, if you continue to stay off topic, your microphone will be muted.) If you write messages in the chat that are off topic, they will be deleted. People may say things that do not make sense to you. Ask questions for clarity; do not attack the speaker. If you have something to add to a question or answer, please type it in the chat, rather than talking over other participants. Additionally, people are going to disagree which is normal and healthy. Focus on being constructive and finding solutions.5. Host, Secretary, & Moderator: The host of the meeting, Peter Cullen Bryan, will come prepared to address many of the concerns he already knows you have. However, he does not have all the answers, at this t
Colleen Karn (she/her)
32:20
This meeting is to gather information about your concerns to take to the June 28th PCA Governing Board meeting, so we can begin working on solutions. To that end, the secretary, Beth Downey, will be taking notes, and the meeting will be recorded. The moderator, Colleen Karn, will keep the meeting running in an orderly fashion, as best she can.
Casey Hoeve
32:46
Can you please provide members with a zoom link to attend the Board meeting for June 28? The meeting for June 15 was not announced. I think it is important to have as much information possible leading up to San Antonio. Also, there is a Confidentiality agreement and Disclosure policy to be discussed on June 28. Is this regarding San Antonio or something else?
Randy D. Nichols
33:07
Michaela - That seems to be a broad statement - couldn't it be said of ANY state that there aer such laws on the books?
Edward Janak
34:20
If the unthinkable happens does PCA have liability insurance to cover any medical costs that might happen?
Kate Koppy (she/her)
34:42
+1 request for hybrid options from the San Antonio conference. Please work with the hotel to build robust internet connectivity in presentation rooms.
Michaela Keating she/her
35:10
That's language from our state law, and university policy, I quickly paraphrased, but if you search for California Government Code Section 11139.8 you will see the details and the list of states on the travel ban
Edward Janak
37:50
1.5 million to cover campuses that allow weapons on campus.
Dave Silverman
40:54
It seems that no one on the board is actually familiar with the specific details of this contract, or spoken to Lynn about it. Why is that?
lynneaking
44:28
I would like to address the point about the SW joint meeting with PCA, when it is my turn to be recognized
Pam Detrixhe
47:10
As an ED, I will say this about contracts, that when a contract is shared with the board, at best 10% will read it. Then it is to the ED of the moment to execute it.
Mav (he/him)
47:19
Realistically, are we going to lose more money in people just bowing out of the conference for Texas (or covid) reasons than the penalty?
G. Ganter (he/they)
47:34
I live near Sandy Hook CT, and sadly, I know a person whose child died there. I do not think anywhere in the US is exempt from such events. Even with COVID's uncertainties, I advocate for having the in-person conference at San Antonio.
Pam Detrixhe
47:43
Mav, I suspect the penalty will be more.
Brenda Boudreau
48:26
The board is familiar with the contract. We have been discussing it at every meeting.
Pam Detrixhe
49:04
Thank you, Brenda.
candice roberts {they/them}
49:12
To the list of concerns, before traveling to San Antonio, I would be interested in the availability of all-gender/gender neutral and/or single stall restrooms available in public areas of the hotel. Should be of interest at every hotel but particularly of concern in a place like Texas
Edward Janak
50:15
If PCA does another round of featured speakers the director of the Center for Prevention of Mass Violence and Suicide in my college has agreed to co-present a session on the truth around guns and violence in schools. https://www.utoledo.edu/education/centers/mass-violence-suicide/
Dave Silverman
50:56
Brenda, you haven’t actually seen the contract, nor had Lynn discuss it. She just said so.
Brenda Boudreau
50:57
That sounds interesting Edward!
Pam Detrixhe
52:07
We negotiated gender neutral restrooms with our hotel, but didn't get to test it more than 1 year.
Casey Hoeve
52:29
Would it be possible to have a virtual conference every other year?
Brenda Boudreau
52:43
Candice, I recorded your question and will look into it.
Casey Hoeve
52:50
When we review new contracts/locations
candice roberts {they/them}
52:52
thank you, brenda
Mav (he/him)
53:25
All of the Above. for what it's worth, there are other orgs I am involved with also dealing with significant membership not wanting to attend conferences in Texas. Right now, it's a lot to ask of “travel to a place people don't feel safe AND give them tax revenue”
Pam Detrixhe
55:14
Trip M, circling back: I find your suggestion that we ask the membership to assume the cost of cancelling in favor of online. Much as I would love it to pan out, I think it's an expensive andn complicated experiment to run.
Trip McCrossin
55:37
Follow up on my earlier question: Sometimes doing the right thing’s costly, so again, is it possible to ask the membership to decide whether we want to simply break the contract and assume the expense through a one-time increase in membership dues?
Randy D. Nichols
55:42
Marty - thank you for the questions. The answer to the first question (the objections to San Antonio) will likely predict the answer to the second (we will move in the way the reasons are framed.)
Randy D. Nichols
56:38
Kate - I do think hybrid is a good idea for the number of reasons you mention - esp, the inclusion of our international panelists.
Olena
57:07
I live in Texas, and I attended a conference in San Antonio last Spring. If you are interested, I could very briefly share my take on the gun violence (and some other) concerns.
Teri Edwards-Hewitt (she/her)
57:59
Just for reference in thinking about future conferences - what is the (average ish) number of attendees (pre-COVID) and what have been the number of room nights we have delivered? Thanks!
Susie Skarl
59:20
Kate--That was a great summary of why hybrid is the way to go in the future. I also think we need to be more inclusive to scholars w/disabilities. Scholars w/disabilities may not be able to travel--even before COVID, etc. Thank you!
Jinx Mylo
59:55
+1 to Susie's comment
Pam Detrixhe
01:00:58
Yes. The unpaid labor (and cost) is not. at. all. trivial.
Teri Edwards-Hewitt (she/her)
01:03:11
The room nights part was answered - Thanks. :-)
Randy D. Nichols
01:03:14
It seems that there is no enthusiasm from this group toward the conference in San Antonio. I don't see how this will translate into a robust enrollment. sigh.
Mav (he/him)
01:04:14
Randy: yes. That's sort of my point. Conferences (everyone's not just PCAs) are way down during COVID and I really can't imagine there's going to be a huge bounce back positive with Texas specifically
Trip McCrossin
01:04:49
If it's going to be bad either way, then why not make the bad better by doing the better political move.
Brenda Boudreau
01:05:09
I think it’s an opportunity to work with many groups in San Antonio who would welcome a chance to speak about their situation. I think we can invite a lot of speakers, work with groups on the ground, etc.
Mav (he/him)
01:05:20
Trip: yes. Agreed.
Randy D. Nichols
01:05:35
Yes, Mav - esp when we're poring water on the firewood.
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:05:41
Maybe we should consult an attorney?
Randy D. Nichols
01:06:16
Brenda - I LOVE this direction. I feared I was the only one.
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:06:34
Surely, that would not cost THAT much.
Pam Detrixhe
01:06:37
They have attorneys.
Brenda Boudreau
01:06:57
We are working on this Randy and welcome suggestions from our membership as well!
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:07:34
I like Brenda's idea as well.
Jen Atkins she/hers
01:07:49
Brenda, this is what the dance area hopes to do—speak/collaborate with Texas artists about their perspectives
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:08:21
FWIW As a regional board member, I've learned that there will be regular attendees who won't be attending a virtual conference due to health-related issues connected and/or lack of institutional support. (It's not just funding; some institutions won't allow faculty members to cancel classes to attend.) While a virtual conference may tend toward greater inclusivity it is not a complete panacea. Alternating in-person/virtual conferences, or hybrid, may have to be something considered long term (unless of course you're ICA, and have a 7-figure operating budget and can do whatever).
Kate Koppy (she/her)
01:08:34
It's ridiculous that hotels are holding this much power over this organization and others like us. How can we work with other professional organizations to push back against the hotel industry?
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:08:47
Alarmed to hear Lynn refer to having to signing another contract to get out of this one. That’s what killed the Canadian Pop Culture Association.
Robin Reid
01:08:53
Agreeing with Brenda and Randy: that there are opportunities to connect with the people and groups in Texas who are consistently overlooked not only by the dominant groups in power in Texas (except when said groups are being gerrymandered, voter suppressed, etc. etc. etc.) but by all the liberals outside the state who assume everybody in Texas is part of the GQP.
Brenda Boudreau
01:09:10
Agreed Robin!
Randy D. Nichols
01:09:53
Well put, Robin.
Michaela Keating she/her
01:10:24
+1 Kate, if the conference must go forward then there needs to be transparency about how difficult this situation is, and hopefully Brenda's idea can try to balance
Pam Detrixhe
01:10:43
Thank you, Olena. Yes, please!
Robin Reid
01:11:01
Tom: I too have a friends (adjunct and tenured) who had that same problem: if they're going to a virtual conference, they are not allowed to cancel classes or give alternate at home/remote assignments. ANd of course travel funding is also disappearing or disappeared during Covid and isn't coming back.
Randy D. Nichols
01:12:53
Hear, Hear, Mark - on trying to predict the votes of states' legislatures and electorates years in advance!
Pam Detrixhe
01:13:44
Thank you, Mark about unknown attrition and how to track who would attend virtual instead of in-person. And how we’ll be learning for a couple more years about all this!
Teri Edwards-Hewitt (she/her)
01:14:13
I attended the Cultural Studies Association Conference 2 weeks ago (ish) and it had a virtual component for some sessions - you did have to tell them over a month in advance in what format (in person or online) you were doing. That may be a possible model.
Kate Koppy (she/her)
01:16:44
For the last two years, ASEEES has run a virtual conference a couple weekends before the in-person conference. They might be a model to look at if the board/membership are interested in going in this direction. The PCA/ACA's organization by sections may lend itself to this kind of split.
Teri Edwards-Hewitt (she/her)
01:17:56
@Kate - I did a conference like that last year - I did the online part - that seemed to work (they were a week apart)
Pam Detrixhe
01:18:21
Thanks, Tom for bringing up the employment issues and raising how we might more aggressively strategize against those trends.
Robin Reid
01:20:20
Tolkien Studies Area: I can look at records/data, but my sense is that I had better attendance in 2022 than I ever did f2f (and a significant percentage can only attend virtual). TSA is a fairly small area (7ish events), but the majority of scholars are in the NE, many are independent scholars or junior scholars and have little to no support. I raised this at the area business meeting, and everybody who attended could not come to a f2rf/San Antonio
Pam Detrixhe
01:20:23
There are so many moving parts: the contract/amendments, # presenters, # registrations, # room nights—all on legs or wheels or something.
Robin Reid
01:20:32
Sorry must run now.
Kelly Pelzel
01:21:28
What is the response rate for the survey to date and how much longer is it open?
Randy D. Nichols
01:22:14
Thank you, Olena. all. I must log out.
Sherry Ginn (QoU)
01:24:21
excellent point Olena!
Pam Detrixhe
01:24:33
Thank you, Olena.
Michaela Keating she/her
01:24:34
Sometimes is about feeling physically safe, as a queer person it's hard to feel safe going to a place that actively promotes inequality toward the LGBTQ community
Edward Janak
01:24:57
well said Michaela.
Pam Detrixhe
01:24:59
And yes, Michaela!
Mav (he/him)
01:25:03
same being black
Michaela Keating she/her
01:25:10
It's not just a political spectrum, sometimes it's literally being afraid of your bodily autonomy and safety
Mav (he/him)
01:26:01
“not worrying about political differences” isn't always an option. And It’s not exactly heartening when the answer is “it shouldn't be about politics”
Casey Hoeve
01:26:02
Especially after the Texas GOP's comments on LBGTQ+ individuals during their latest conference
Tiffany (she/her)
01:26:21
Uplifting Michaela’s and Mav’s comments
Jinx Mylo
01:26:34
^^ same
AJ Hobson (they/she)
01:26:38
Exactly
Marla Harris
01:27:08
same--also treatment of women and women's rights
AJ Hobson (they/she)
01:28:20
Thank you, Mav!
Michaela Keating she/her
01:28:24
Yes!!
Julia Empey
01:28:31
Exactly, Mav
Edward Janak
01:28:52
Great points Mav
Sam Lehman
01:28:57
^^exactly. echoing all of these sentiments. Well said, Mav! and Michaela!
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:29:13
The study of culture, popular or otherwise, is always a political gesture. It is not possible to separate this work from power dynamics. I also think that the situation with COVID is NOT going to be much different from what it is now
AJ Hobson (they/she)
01:29:35
Agree, Tom.
Trip McCrossin
01:29:42
Agreed
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:29:52
and there will be serious issues with this thing, esp. given how the US has addressed this problem.
Pam Detrixhe
01:29:57
Thank you, Mav. I totally hear you. And everyone else in the organization *will* assume the cost, one way or another (cost now, or cost in the future).
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:30:00
(COVID)
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:30:14
Mav - from a middle-aged, straight, white guy, well said.
Dave Silverman
01:30:17
It sounds like the decision was made before this meeting was called.
Edward Janak
01:30:37
seems likely Dave.
Dave Silverman
01:30:59
It was in the email from the president.
Jen Atkins she/hers
01:31:15
Well said, Mav. So important.
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:31:24
Sorry Dave, what decision?
Dave Silverman
01:31:33
To go to SA
Laura Gibson
01:31:35
@Tom Grochowski-Covid is my big concern too. I would feel pretty much the same way about Texas as Seattle. I have some reservations about Texas, but Covid is my larger concern right now.
Olena Leipnik
01:31:38
I am now not sure whether I really live in Texas. The concerns I am hearing do not seem to be based on the reality of academic environtment of Texas.
Brenda Boudreau
01:32:08
There are people on the ground in Texas who are fighting back against all of this. Can the PCA do something proactively to work with these groups and organizations?
Mav (he/him)
01:32:19
THanks everyone
Susie Skarl
01:32:28
Great discussion--sorry I need to sign off early---thank you all!
Kate Koppy (she/her)
01:33:06
@Brenda, if that's a goal, then it would help to have that announced before well before the CFP deadline, as people are making decisions about whether to submit or nor.
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:33:16
David. What are the alternatives? Who will pay NOT to go to SA?
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:33:42
And how much are they willing to pay?
Brenda Boudreau
01:33:46
Kate that’s a great point.
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:34:01
Never apologize for puppies AJ :-)
Peter Cullen Bryan
01:34:14
Dogs are the best part of Zoom.
Dave Silverman
01:35:18
Nick, I don’t know. but the contract is legal, and while we can hope to negotiate it, but we can’t afford to walk away.
Sam Lehman
01:35:19
Well said, AJ!
Marla Harris
01:35:41
very good points, AJ
Pam Detrixhe
01:36:35
Olena, could you say more, please?
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:37:30
David, what negotiating power does the PCA have?
Mav (he/him)
01:37:50
Yes, I certainly would.
Teri Edwards-Hewitt (she/her)
01:37:56
I need to log off - thank you everyone and thanks to all who volunteer & put in the hours :-)
Dave Silverman
01:37:57
Not much Nick.
J
01:38:10
Could we get Beto O'Rourk?
Peter Cullen Bryan
01:38:21
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSewHGFarfVFwj5kBqk464BufOnIqYNgcbrMP-LJ7JeepaJlDA/viewform?vc=0&c=0&w=1&flr=0&usp=mail_form_link
Nick Baxter-Moore
01:38:49
As noted earlier, renegotiating a contract by signing another potentially punitive contract is a dangerous tactic.
Julia Empey
01:39:03
I agree with Nick
Kelly Pelzel
01:39:06
Thank you
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:39:15
I'm fortunate that my institution will support most if not all of my expenses for conferences, and yes I could probably afford a significant increase to help address whatever loss we have (though my commute cost has just doubled) but that's probably not most attendees.
AJ Hobson (they/she)
01:39:38
Is there a way to determine how many “active” members there are in PCA? (Those who have attended 3 or more conferences or something vs. 1 off attendees).
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:40:07
I am getting the sense that a LOT of people may change their survey response after hearing this deliberation. Speaking as a sociologist, the survey now has significant validity problems.
Dave Silverman
01:40:17
Nick, ask Lynn
Brenda Boudreau
01:40:30
Peter can you elaborate?
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:40:58
Which peter? Me?
Peter Cullen Bryan
01:41:14
Apologies, Board Meeting is next Tuesday, the 28th.
Dave Silverman
01:41:24
I get what you’re saying Peter.
Peter Cullen Bryan
01:41:47
Brenda, what can I elaborate on?
Brenda Boudreau
01:41:50
Peter N., yes. :-)
Brenda Boudreau
01:42:41
Is there something else we can do —another survey? We want to hear from members. We know that there are concerns and we want to try and address them as best we can.
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:42:49
Well, my own viewpoints have been swayed in this meeting. The chat suggests I am not the only one. I took the survey w/out all this context.
Mav (he/him)
01:43:13
@Peter are the survey answers available for us to see too?
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:43:21
I am have responded, but I would like to "re vote".
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:43:53
This is why the vote should AFTER the debate. :-)
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:43:58
I have to say that the survey question about open carry reminded me about those laws.
Peter Cullen Bryan
01:44:02
Mav, I plan to send out the survey results to the membership once it has wrapped.
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:44:07
"...should com after the debate."
Jen Atkins she/hers
01:44:20
My sense was that we could send the poll around to our colleagues, who aren't here, so that wouldn’t skew the results (and so few people out of the membership are here, many people overall are absent), right?
Kate Koppy (she/her)
01:44:27
On the topic of Covid, please consider linking mask and vaccine mandates to specific numbers related to community transmission. Please also ask the hotel to publicize the measures they're taking to improve ventilation and filtration.
Peter Nieckarz (he/him/his)
01:44:57
But it WOULD skew the results. You would have people voting without all the knowledge that was gained in this meeting.
Jinx Mylo
01:45:20
I noticed the survey only asked if the location would influence your decision to attend. It would be interesting to see if the location would prevent people from submitting proposals at all (vs making a decision to attend later)
Jen Atkins she/hers
01:45:36
@Peter: ahh
Sam Lehman
01:46:07
^I would be interested in that too @Jinx
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:46:26
@Nick FWIW good to see you here and thanks for your input on Canadian PCA.
Mav (he/him)
01:47:22
the survey also has the problem that it only allows you tp pick one negative reason. For instance, I imagine there are people concerned with covid AND texas safety (I certainly am)
Laura Gibson
01:47:24
@Jinx Mylo-For 2022, I was not planning to submit a proposal when it was in person, but once it moved online, I decided to submit a proposal.
Julia Empey
01:47:37
Canadian PCA slapped, I miss it
Jinx Mylo
01:47:37
@Mav: yes, that was true for me
Jinx Mylo
01:47:45
@Laura: same
Laura Gibson
01:48:55
@Mav-I was concerned about Covid and Texas as well.
Dave Silverman
01:49:44
They don’t have to.
Michaela Keating she/her
01:50:37
I need to leave, but thanks to everyone for a fruitful and collegial discussions, I always love being around PCA folks!
Brenda Boudreau
01:50:51
Thanks for comments Michaela!
Sam Lehman
01:52:46
I also need to sign off, but will look out for the recording. Thank you everyone!
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:54:18
I don't know how the larger Marriott corporation is doing, but our regional was to be in 2020 at one in NJ, and we were first able to push it back to 2022, and then I think because of some management shifts there, we were able to walk away from the contract. (Our numbers are obviously smaller, and it's very lucky for us, and not everyone is happy about going virtual, but I don't know that it's part of the larger corporate approach to let us walk away.)
Mav (he/him)
01:54:38
this brings us back to the beginning. I think the numbers are going to be VERY down. Yes. I would love to be in person. I miss it a lot. But I also am concerned with spending money on this conference (even accepting the risks) without university backing. If I spend that kind of money on my own and show up to 200 people I'd be pissed.
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:55:12
The hotel industry is still struggling. I suspect that South is getting good response because it's New Orleans. (It's why I submitted there, to be transparent.)
Tom Grochowski he/him/his
01:56:04
I am signing off to play Dad's Uber but I may try to sign back on on my phone.
Pam Detrixhe
01:56:09
Re) regional NJ Conference: they will make boatloads more now that we are out of their hair.
Nick Baxter-Moore
02:02:10
Has San Antonio (or rather Texas) has hit a perfect storm this year?
Dave Silverman
02:02:32
Yes
Amanda Hobson (they/she)
02:03:33
Thank you all!
Lynnea Chapman King
02:03:35
Thank you all.