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Contractor Needs Assessment Results with EMI - Shared screen with speaker view
Ted Kidd
36:58
If there are stacked benefits, people will spend more on electrification...
Panama Bartholomy
43:59
Ted: we are about to release a financing study suggesting exactly that stacking of benefits. Webinar coming on that soon
Ann Edminster
46:34
Plumbers -- of course! Less piping!! :)
Ken Johnson
47:32
Your previous slide referenced plumbers and electricians. What about HVAC installers?
Panama Bartholomy
48:09
Those brutal California winters
Ted Kidd
48:42
Actually, probably more the cost of selling. "When I bring up heat pumps it starts arguments. I don't care what I install, I just want to get the job " is the plumbers I know.
Ted Kidd
50:26
Yes. Contractors dealing with customer confusion about new technology via telephone complaints is a cost too.
John Miles
50:30
Plus Plumbers hate the thought of going back to the home to do maintenance after the sale of the water heater - sell, install and move on
Ken Johnson
51:18
VCHPs for space conditioning usually require a much smaller breaker (15-35amps) than a traditional condenser (50-60).
Stephen Gribble
51:57
is that Sanden John Miles?
Brady Faught
52:08
How about city permits? Gas permits are generally super easy, and many muni's have a lot of hoops for heat pumps. Would that also dissuade contractors?
Ted Kidd
52:08
Good point about having space in the panel...
John Miles
52:59
Yes, actually Eco2 Systems John Miles ;-)
Panama Bartholomy
53:23
Formerly Sanden...
Ted Kidd
54:29
We have pulled 10 natural gas meters, 1 propane and 1 oil
Mark Sandeen
58:57
Natural gas future prices are rising rapidly https://www.cmegroup.com/trading/energy/natural-gas/natural-gas.html
Ted Kidd
58:57
Control/better comfort???
Alice Sung
59:11
Donna, Sorry if I missed this in the beginning, did your line of questioning ever differentiate between choice for new installations versus retrofits?
Ken Johnson
01:00:33
Need to differentiate between traditional heat pumps, which cut out in the high 30's, vs. mini splits (variable capacity heat pumps) which are effective in much colder climates.
Alice Sung
01:00:51
And, were the contractors an even mix of larger contractor firms (who do both commercial and MFR?/SFR?) and small shops, for example, 1-2 persons or sole proprietor plumbers, for example? (can you characterize your respondent pool a bit more?)
Ted Kidd
01:01:39
Carrier Greenspeed and others go to -20f. So persistent myths is a problem.
Ken Johnson
01:02:31
Ted, traditional single or dual speed vs. variable capacity.
Ted Kidd
01:03:12
HVAC contractors are exposed to enclosure risk. IF they don't understand how good/bad the enclosure (leakage) is, they have a lot of risk that is beyond their control, or even understanding.
Ted Kidd
01:03:41
Ken, most have cop greater than zero down to 5f
Ann Edminster
01:04:18
Not all that surprising bc electricians don't typically get involved in the WH selection.
Panama Bartholomy
01:06:34
Great discussion and questions all. We will ask donna after her comments end. keep it going!
Ted Kidd
01:07:56
Pardon... COP greater than 1.
Panama Bartholomy
01:08:09
big new seminal study on the future of gas put out by Energy Commission last week: The Challenge of RetailGas in California’s LowCarbon Future. https://ww2.energy.ca.gov/2019publications/CEC-500-2019-055/CEC-500-2019-055-F.pdf
Panama Bartholomy
01:08:41
Those wives!
Ted Kidd
01:08:57
We recommend grid (backup) for many reasons, comfort during defrost, but the greatest benefit is reheat dehumidification.
Mark Sandeen
01:10:10
Did you talk about how heat pumps could replace air conditioning systems? I’m guessing that panels that can handle AC, can handle heat pump replacement.
Peter May-Ostendorp
01:10:49
Many solar installers are starting to consider electrification upgrades as a side business as solar reaches mass adoption in some areas. I’d like to know if the research team is aware of better surveys on that trend.
Alice Sung
01:11:05
I dunno, it could be" those ol' husbands " that harbor those tales of gas always being cheaper- better- don't question me.
Mark Sandeen
01:11:46
A boiler installation requires both a plumber and an electrician…
Panama Bartholomy
01:12:45
Typical for husbands to call out “wives tales”! Passing the blame!
Randall Higa
01:13:55
My guess is that in older homes with indoor gas water heaters, replacing a new gas water heater would not be up to code (inadequate space, inadequate combustion air, improper venting, etc.), but the plumbers, based on their experience will install it anyway. However, because they have less experience with HPWH, they would tend to follow code and manufacturer's installation requirements.
Ted Kidd
01:14:03
PACE soured people on financing for low income because of net worth eradication?
Brady Faught
01:16:03
Would 0% financing (a planned Canadian federal initiative) get over the barrier of adding debt to LMI households? Or is debt debt
Ted Kidd
01:16:52
IMO, 40k worth of windows is not equal to a 3k water heater.....
Ted Kidd
01:18:14
How about create an incentive at the supply house that makes Heat Pumps $500 less than straight AC? Then let the sales force drive change.
Panama Bartholomy
01:18:29
Thats the one, Ted.
Alice Sung
01:18:38
Yes, we should not be perpetuating stereotyping, nor looking to assign "blame.' Let's move forward with positive and equitable solutions for all.
Panama Bartholomy
01:18:44
need to make it hard to choose gas
k m
01:19:30
What are the HPWH maintenance needs that respondents cite?
karl weiss
01:19:46
I don't believe that upstream incentives work, too much mark up occurs before customer gets the equitment. Incentives & rebates are the best way to drive adoption. It puts money in the customers hands.
Mark Sandeen
01:20:47
Have you considered recommending HP to replace AC systems. Many AC systems need to be replaced - might be easier to replace AC systems with heat pumps than replacing boilers with heat pumps…
Ted Kidd
01:22:44
Midwest Energy had a financing mechanism that allowed them to finance "beyond the meter" that I thought was pretty cool.
Ruby Rose Yepez
01:23:08
Follow up to previous question, would additional maintenance be due to Contractors not installing correctly?
Ted Kidd
01:24:08
Not COMMISSIONING properly too...
Alice Sung
01:24:38
@Karl, I agree, and would include midstream incentives in that same difficulty. Even if the mark-up isn't great, just the lack of transparency and perception from the customer overrides any sort of sense of trust they are not being somehow "taken." This is a serious challenge-- that the "seller/ or of the marketing" does not have the customer's interests at heart, but their own bottom line??
Brady Faught
01:24:44
Vancouver will be requiring commissioning for all new homes (gas and electric) starting 2021 as well as ventilation (HRV's)
Ted Kidd
01:24:45
Commissioning the thermostat takes us 30 minutes. Many simply plug in and walk away