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APAP Break/Room Conversations - Shared screen with speaker view
*Ronee Penoi*
01:10:39
Green New Theatre is here! https://www.groundwaterarts.com/green-new-theatre.html
Karen Henderson
01:10:50
Thanks, Ronee!
Krista Bradley
01:16:36
From : Liz Levitt Hirsch-Happy to hear about the new lens at UA. Terrific!
Krista Bradley
01:18:05
The creating new futures doc section on force majeure has been very informative in developing a new artist rider (what to ask for, negotiate and bottom lines moving forward)https://www.facebook.com/groups/creatingnewfutures
Krista Bradley
01:18:43
Thanks, Michelle Fletcher!
Michelle Fletcher
01:19:10
Thanks Krista for sharing what I just submitted (meant to send to all not just panelist :)
Michael Harrington
01:22:22
Yes!!! (And another vote for the snap function)
Andrew Glick
01:22:25
Dispose of the word deposit.
*Rika Iino*
01:22:38
Snap snap!
Krista Bradley
01:22:55
Where is the snap function?
Mara Isaacs
01:23:38
Oh my heart. Partnership means shared risk.
Michelle Fletcher
01:24:46
Yes vulnerability quest! @Heena :)
Byron Au Yong
01:26:38
“protect each other while we fail together” 👍
*Clyde Valentin*
01:26:54
those resources are public resources, meaning they belong to all of us.
Catherine Zimmerman
01:27:52
yes Ronee
Catherine Zimmerman
01:28:40
move the money, move the resources
Gwenmarie Ewing
01:30:16
Watch this video of Slung Low in the North of England who are a nationally recognized theatre company but are currently feeding their community on behalf of the local government.
Gwenmarie Ewing
01:30:18
https://vimeo.com/424586556
Julianna Crespo
01:31:13
I do think the issuing contract entity has alot of power to list their payment structures. Once the contracts are signed it can be difficult to negotiate different terms depending on your contract department. I have seen contracts come through and be approved that list 3 to 4 payments spread out and some of them nonrefundable.
Krista Bradley
01:31:43
From Lenore Naxon 01:31 PMWhat are strategies for bringing our donors, boards and audience (community, family) along to embrace this change. We rely on them.
Krista Bradley
01:32:08
Vincent Iaropoli 01:33 PMI'm greatly interested in learning how the panelists might suggest making venue rentals more equitible, particularly in the university presenting setting. How do you balance/align fiduciary goals?
Byron Au Yong
01:34:23
“How to act with less urgency” 👍🏽
margaret lawrence
01:35:53
Adding to the request above for discussion of board integration!
Krista Bradley
01:36:01
Go Bonnie
Amy Lam
01:36:18
Educating our donors and boards is a HUGE piece, and in many cases where we need to start if we were to distribute our resource in a meaningful way. I just gave a 15 speech to our major donors on zoom earlier this week about the “ecosystem” in which we work. We can only survive this as an industry if we all rise together, I told them.
*Heena Patel*
01:37:12
Words of Bonnie
*Heena Patel*
01:37:13
Institutions cannot reinvent themselves entirely in 2 weeks. Indeed, we cannot even dismantle them in that time, let alone rebuild something new that will function in an unknown set of circumstances. People cannot simultaneously grieve, redo the work of an entire year, alter every operating procedure that made that work barely possible to begin with, and creatively generate thoughtful and viable alternatives, while functioning with 25% of the staff. Leaders cannot alter every system, every process, every assumption, and then present a whole new sustainable model in a nice pretty package for your consumption in the snap of a finger.
Nina Patel
01:38:51
In regard to leadership and change under pressure, I think about the founder of Reddit - Alexis Ohanian who recently resigned because he knew his voice was not the one that needs to be heard right now. What are your thoughts about humble leadership that gives away our power, perhaps a changing of the guard?
Julianna Crespo
01:41:06
Who was Bonnie addressing with those words, "for your consumption."
Esty Dinur
01:41:19
Great question, Nina.
Catherine Zimmerman
01:41:30
it was a face book post
*Heena Patel*
01:42:06
Bonnie was referring to board, and audience. I believe with the “your consumption”
Bonnie Schock
01:42:28
I was mostly addressing boards, donors, white power that wants us to just replicate the same thing.
*Heena Patel*
01:42:39
Thank you Bonnie. Great to see you here.
Jason Hodges
01:43:38
Bonnie, it Is a good reminder to us all who are feeling the urgency that Katy described. I know I am. I am going to share that with my board
*Rika Iino*
01:44:05
Yes to artists as full humans in service of their community and the greater good
*Ronee Penoi*
01:44:21
I deeply respect Bonnie’s stating that this is hard work that takes space to unpack. You can’t undo 400+ years of inequity in this country overnight. I will hold though, that many black-led organizations have been doing this for years - grieving their losses that disproportionately affect them (murders, natural disasters, more), not having access to needed funding, often with colleagues turning a blind eye. I only ask that as we give ourselves permission to rebuild WELL and with kindness to ourselves, that we accept and live in the discomfort of this moment. That we don’t lose sight of the reason that we have to change these systems in the first place.
Catherine Zimmerman
01:44:35
“artists as full humans beings”
Julianna Crespo
01:46:28
Thank you @Ronee much needed reminder.
Bonnie Schock
01:48:04
Yes, Ronee. Absolutely. And, we need time to do it right. I feel the pressure of the existing hierarchies pushing its weight around to come up with "solutions" that will only perpetuate the inequities. We must make change and to do so - in institutional settings - is a process that we must commit to, or we have to commit to killing those institutions (and that's a totally viable approach) and then move ahead more organically.
Leymis Bolanos Wilmott
01:48:16
Thank you Bonnie, if its ok, I would like to share your statement with my board.
*Ronee Penoi*
01:48:30
Yes Bonnie!
Bonnie Schock
01:49:19
Sure Leymis. As it will help you, for sure.
Byron Au Yong
01:49:24
“many black-led organizations have been doing this for years” the anti-oppression work happens in many PGM organizations; typical for mainstream institutions to continue to ignore them, or invite them only when needed
Krista Bradley
01:50:40
Closet metaphor: Also #newwardrobe
Kaisha Johnson
01:56:45
Yes. Many institutions needed to sunset a long time ago. New institutions in service to the people will replace them. Let’s focus on what we’ll all gain, and not what some people think they’ll lose.
*Ronee Penoi*
01:57:37
For Danielle- A low-profit limited liability company (L3C) is a legal form of business entity in the United States that was created to bridge the gap between non-profit and for-profit investing by providing a structure that facilitates investments in socially beneficial, for-profit ventures
Dayna Martinez
01:58:10
Yes, Kaisha!
Bonnie Schock
01:58:22
Love that perspective Kaisha. What we'll all gain, not what some think they will lose.
*Ronee Penoi*
01:58:25
Exactly, Claudia.
Julianna Crespo
01:58:50
But who has the power to push change at a board level? I believe only the board members themselves. So those board members need to decide to change their makeup and structure. I have been fighting this fight for years as I am sure many others have. Nominating POC leadership for board seats and seeing little action.
Krista Bradley
01:59:38
From Jenni Hatcher to All Panelists: 02:04 PMAfter having run a 501c3 PAC, I can tell you. That is the issue to contend with and that work will butt right up against so much white privilege & community politics in even to get the vote to change the governing by-laws of organizations to allow new, healthier, more functional, healthy parameters of ‘board members’
Bonnie Schock
02:00:10
Yes, Katy. Thank you for raising that.
Mary Lou Aleskie
02:01:03
Hi chad!
Mary Lou Aleskie
02:04:18
And some times we find our place within white led supremacist institutions as the best place to make change happen from within by breaking down existing constructs and systems. That’s not easy.
Cindy Hwang
02:04:45
So well said Chad!
mercedes caxaj
02:07:00
What are white-led institutions and organizations doing to recognize BIPOC-led organizations that have been doing representative work for years? These institutions are forgotten when white-led institutions all of a sudden become awake and then celebrate/are celebrated for when they finally have representation as an objective .
Linsey Bostwick
02:10:17
Yes Clyde -
Catherine Zimmerman
02:11:11
thank you Clyde
*Ronee Penoi*
02:12:17
Yes heena!
Aaron Shackelford
02:13:03
Much like the contracts conversation, I think university arts orgs need to model and widely share tactics for overcoming the institutional structures that — probably quite intentionally — disadvantage job applicants (degree requirements, etc)
*Ronee Penoi*
02:13:14
Yes Aaron!
Kaisha Johnson
02:14:04
Thanks for the shout out Heena, and thank you for your thoughtful and precise facilitation.
*Clyde Valentin*
02:15:01
Internally, we’ve worked internally to find “hacks” in our university system. I can share at another time perhaps.
Julianna Crespo
02:15:08
Agreeing with @Aaron. The institutions with the most power and most difficult to change are universities large organizations that most likely will weather this storm. So how do those of us who work there help to change our boards?
Deborah Sommers
02:15:18
Mentorship and creating networks opportunities will be important to creating more opportunities.
*Bill Bragin*
02:15:18
I’d love your university hacks, Clyde!
*Clyde Valentin*
02:15:32
But I can say the “hacking” is real. Thx Bill.
margaret lawrence
02:15:53
Yes, Clyde--need those hacks!
Jennie Wasserman
02:15:59
Large orgs also have to reevaluate their internship programs and recruitment at the entry level. I feel that unpaid internships are immoral.
Julianna Crespo
02:16:04
I have been using the workbook Roberto Uno came up with at Arts Change Us
Karen Henderson
02:16:13
Yes, Clyde, please share those hacks!
Megan Whitaker
02:16:17
Also want the hacks, Clyde! :)
Aaron Shackelford
02:16:18
Maybe we need a university arts hackathon?
*Clyde Valentin*
02:16:31
I’m down with the hackathon
*Bill Bragin*
02:16:35
hahahaha. yes
Krista Bradley
02:16:55
Yes to University Arts Hackathon!
*Clyde Valentin*
02:17:26
Thank you Ronee
Catherine Zimmerman
02:17:51
beautiful Ronee
Deborah Sommers
02:18:04
Good luck on Hackathons and breaking through layers of faculty privilege and administrative privilege and control.
*Clyde Valentin*
02:18:32
Relevant and Essential Chad!
Krista Bradley
02:20:16
You all have 4 min
margaret lawrence
02:20:50
Thank you all very much and thank you APAP for these timely and relevant discussions.
*Bill Bragin*
02:20:59
Thanks to Heena and all the panelists for yet another meaningful and though provoking panel. L
PennyMaria Jackson
02:21:03
Thank you for beautifully leading this vital conversation, Heena.
Jacob Yarrow
02:21:23
Thanks, all. Appreciate all of the insight and care.
Bonnie Schock
02:22:02
Thank you all. Inspiring.
Stephanie Rolland
02:22:11
YES HEENA! DECADES.
*Rika Iino*
02:22:23
YASSSS
margaret lawrence
02:22:24
YAS CHAD!!!!! Hahahahahah
Marc Bamuthi Joseph
02:22:30
Ka-BOOM!!!
Karen Henderson
02:22:37
Yay, Chad!
Jacob Yarrow
02:22:38
YES!!!
Krista Bradley
02:22:52
I think that's another t-shirt!
margaret lawrence
02:23:10
Krista yes--instead of conference bag!
Krista Bradley
02:23:16
Word
Annalisa Dias
02:23:24
say it ronee!!
Esty Dinur
02:23:42
Yes, Ronee!
Emily Johnson
02:23:43
RONEE!!!
Megan Kline Crockett
02:23:49
Thank you so much for the discussion!
Shane Cadman
02:24:09
Thank you all!
Ruth Waalkes
02:24:45
thank you all for this conversation today.
*Karen Fischer*
02:24:56
Thank you all!!
Byron Au Yong
02:25:02
Loved this panel. Yes to the university hackathon
Karen Henderson
02:25:18
Great panel! Thank you so much!!
Rachel Katwan
02:25:23
powerful conversation. THANK YOU Heena for leading and being such an inspiring moderator. great panel.
Mary Lou Aleskie
02:25:27
THANK YOU ALL!!!
Michael Harrington
02:26:10
Another great conversation. Thank you all!
Nina Patel
02:26:13
Inspiring and insightful, thank you
*Ronee Penoi*
02:26:17
Those principles (shout out to Green New Theatre/groundwater arts): decolonized leadership, publicly transparent budgeting, community accountability, divest from fossil fuels, right relationship to land and history
margaret lawrence
03:33:11
Renae!!!!!
Krista Bradley
03:47:22
#dothework
Suzanne Callahan
03:47:30
Snap, Jawole!
*Bill Bragin*
03:48:18
This is a powerful way to think about building muscle, capacity, skill, effectiveness…
Adele Myers
03:49:13
Honesty. Truth. Work. Yes Jawole!
Julianna Crespo
03:49:48
Thank you for this discussion around the value of the emotional labor. I think it is something that many organizations struggle with. Where does asking for participation in a meeting(s) cross over into something that should be paid for rather than free.
*Heena Patel*
03:57:05
Kaisha shared a powerful call out of this in our sector.
*Heena Patel*
03:57:49
https://medium.com/@kaijohnson_54513/enough-already-with-the-statements-of-solidarity-arts-world-c2d1ee03e899?fbclid=IwAR17x9-uChNHWTgPh3W5ZWC-xJoM4IdMLLstkdU6oJSET13zQC_z2NcfudQ
margaret lawrence
03:58:30
Agree with comments above concerning boards--I know of some (non arts) nonprofits who have started to compensate those board members who cannot serve otherwise. It startled me until I really thought about it. They are committed to diverse boards who represent their community. Period.
Shelley Aisner
03:58:40
Thank you for bringing up the issue of personal values conflicting with the organization that one works with. This is very important. I would like to hear more on how someone deals with that . Do you remain and continue to help facilitate change? When do you throw in the white flag of surrender. Or do you?
Rachel Katwan
04:00:06
Thank you for continuing to bring this fearless truth into the room Jawole as you always have
Krista Bradley
04:01:00
From Juliana Crespo: I would like to hear more on how someone deals with that . Do you remain and continue to help facilitate change? When do you throw in the white flag of surrender. Or do you?
*Heena Patel*
04:01:20
@julianna - Some questions to consider: would you pay to go to a workshop to learn what you would learn from that meeting? Do you financially benefit from the information / knowledge that you will learn? Will your organization’s reputation / positioning in the community or sector increase because of information that you will gain? Are they helping someone in your organization be more effective?
*Heena Patel*
04:01:41
Then YES you should be paying them - and payment can take different forms (cash of course is the best).
Mary Lou Aleskie
04:02:50
Grateful for this statement www.weseeyouwat.com which is a good place for white arts workers to start doing the work with personal acceptance of culpability. We see ourselves. Admit it.
Julianna Crespo
04:03:02
T
Hannah Henderson
04:03:55
Hi Bill!
*Heena Patel*
04:04:21
@julianna Ex. After being asked by so many venues to learn how to market to South Asian communities (and doing this because it is for the greater food for South Asian artists), I have realized that that feeds into white supremacist culture - that white organizations that benefiting from my labour. So now I need to be paid for doing that labor for them. Because that helps their marketing department do their job better, it helps their ticket sales, it expands their audiences.
*Bill Bragin*
04:06:57
Yes, Jennifer. So much of that.
*Heena Patel*
04:08:00
@julianna - one more question to consider - what are they getting out of the meeting. Are their any tangible benefits (besides building a relationship with your organization because that is still about centering whiteness and white organizations).
Julianna Crespo
04:08:12
@Heena I appreciate your points! I think I am specifically talking about board positions and committee positions that are not paid in structure. most non profits operate this way. How can we be fair to POC sitting in those positions and having to deal with white majority uneducated in anti-racist work.
kenneth foster
04:09:32
Yes - living in the space of chnage - always!
Julianna Crespo
04:09:53
I think all other change trickles down from the positions of power in an organization. Because those are the ones approving our budgets, creating policies that staff are required to adhere to.
Cindy Hwang
04:10:59
Science of empathy - Love it!!!!
Hannah Henderson
04:11:03
I love that
Dayna Martinez
04:11:23
Beautifully put, Stefon!
Catherine Zimmerman
04:11:31
beautifully said.
*Heena Patel*
04:11:38
@julianna - in my consulting work with organizations, I always speaking to them about having a budget for committees (the lens that I am generally working with them is around cultural specificity). That they should be at the LEAST be feeding people, putting meetings in places that are “neutral” vs being at the organization.
*Heena Patel*
04:12:01
Yes @Stefon!
*Heena Patel*
04:13:41
@Julianna - resurfacing something Sean shared yesterday - is how putting BIPOC people within white supremacist spaces can and is traumatizing. So what practices are being put into place to make it a safe space.
Julianna Crespo
04:16:07
@Heena thank you, I have been really thinking we need to pay for those sitting in these positions. Also, I agree white supremacist spaces would be traumatizing, but the majority of venues I interact with don't fall into that category. i think it is more uneducated ignorance of issues around representation.
*Heena Patel*
04:19:06
@Julianna - I think paying is a GREAT idea. Even if the spaces are not white supremacist spaces, I would also lift up that microagressions are also fatiguing and so much of what BIPOC need to do within the arts is deal with the continuous cuts of microagressions. Small and big strategies can be helpful for this. Ex of a tactic that Pres Obama used in observation of the gender inequity in dealing with the press corps is that he would only take questions alternating between a female and male reporter. So if a woman didn’t speak up, he would wait until one did before going to a man.
*Heena Patel*
04:20:28
A tactic that women in the Obama administration used in meetings addressing the fact that woman’s ideas were often not taken seriously or credited to her, is that the other women made it a point to amplify the idea from a woman, naming her and the idea after she does.
*Heena Patel*
04:22:30
What was NOT seen before — white teenagers using Tik Tok to share their frustrations in their journeys to talk to their racist parents. And #BLM trending and going viral on Tik Tok with videos not just from Black people.
kennethfoster
04:31:05
Stefon. Wow.
Catherine Zimmerman
04:32:25
yes Stefan! Wow.
Julianna Crespo
04:35:53
@Renae Yes this question!
Shelley Aisner
04:36:33
Thank you Renae!!!!
Dayna Martinez
04:39:25
You speak my heart, Stefon
Julianna Crespo
04:40:03
@Stefon thank you for pointing to the importance of metrics. I think it should be adopted by boards and committees to give clarity on the goals and progress.
Shelley Aisner
04:40:29
Thank you Kenneth. This is the position I am in.
Shelley Aisner
04:42:44
and thank you Stefan for bringing up the importance of metrics. bringing it to boards is a great idea.
Amy Schwartzman
04:47:31
We also need to recognize that being able to choose to leave can be a luxury some don’t have.
*Heena Patel*
04:47:36
Love the different frames you have offered through which to approach this question. Thank you.
Shane Cadman
04:48:23
Thanks everybody! Great job moderating Renae (and Heena before). Much love to all!
Krista Bradley
04:50:48
Yes, Thank you, Ken
*RikaIino*
04:50:51
Thank you Ken
Hannah Henderson
04:51:03
So nice to hear you all talk and especially to get a dose of Bill Bragin's brain
Kathleen Spehar
04:51:15
So much gratitude to all of you- very inspiring and deeply valuable, especially as we consider how to move together from here.
Catherine Zimmerman
04:51:16
absolutely Ken. thank you
*Heena Patel*
04:51:23
YES Ken!
Shelley Aisner
04:51:34
Thank you so much all of you. This has been very inspiring and helpful.
*Linda Brumbach*
04:51:52
Wonderful panel. THANK YOU ALL!
PennyMaria Jackson
04:52:08
Yes! Thank you, everyone.
Krista Bradley
04:52:13
THANK YOU!
*Heena Patel*
04:52:14
Thank you Renae, Stefan, Bill (and Bilmo), Jawole, and Ken for your wisdom and reminders as we build the future together today!
margaret lawrence
04:52:27
Yes, thanks for this wonderful panel--everything APAP has produced has been excellent. We are lucky to have it. We are listening.
*Karen Fischer*
04:52:27
Thank you all!
Rachel Cooper
04:52:38
Important conversation and gathering of tribe
Catherine Zimmerman
04:52:41
I’m with you Ken and Bill. my head is spinning
*Heena Patel*
04:53:02
And THANK YOU Rika, Marc Bamuthi, DBR, Sozo Creatives, and APAP for putting together these powerful ACTIONABLE conversations.
Scott Stoner
04:53:22
Leadership in Action
Joe Clifford
04:53:43
Feeling inspired by this collective wisdom!
Rena Shagan
04:53:46
Thank you for a great conversation. But let it not stop here. We need to move forward NOW!!
Cindy Hwang
04:53:52
Bravo to all the speakers! Thank you Renae and Heena for moderating. My head will be spinning for a while =)
kennethfoster
04:54:07
YES - to Afro-Futursim! Create the future we want!
elena moon park
04:54:08
Thank you all! Really moving.
Lisa Booth
04:54:26
Thank you all for a powerful, insightful and thought provoking two days! Onward.
Emily Johnson
04:54:59
Quyana all!
kennethfoster
04:55:00
Awed by beautiful colleagues!
Kathleen Spehar
04:55:23
Thank you APAP!
*Bill Bragin*
04:55:36
All of our work is created in context of communities. Communities that exist and also the communities we want to exist. Visioning those communities, and pointing our work to manifest them is the challenge and the payback.
margaret lawrence
04:55:56
Thank you Mario!!!!
*Heena Patel*
04:56:00
Beautifully said Bill.
Adele Myers
04:56:40
Rupture is an end and a beginning. Thank you
*Karen Fischer*
04:57:00
Heartfult applause to you Mario!!
*Bill Bragin*
04:57:10
I’m so grateful to Mario for all his service to the field. I learned so much from being in the APAP board room with him, and seeing how he led by listening, empowering, and acting.
Kathleen Spehar
04:57:22
Thank you for your service Mario!
*Heena Patel*
04:57:39
Thank you Mario for all of your work and service.
Mary Lou Aleskie
04:57:39
So much gratitude for these past two days! Thanks Sozo and all who made this happen. Thank you Mario for all your years of leadership.
Catherine Zimmerman
04:57:57
thank you Mario!
Nina Patel
04:58:06
Thank for your commitment and inspiration today and yesterday. Well done team!
*RikaIino*
04:58:17
Thank you Mario & APAP